There is considerable doubt about the timings of some of the events on 17 July but one good "fix" is a telephone call taken by Dr Kelly in the mid afternoon. This is number 53 in the schedule of responses to issues raised http://www.attorneygeneral.gov.uk/Publications/Documents/Schedule%20of%20responses%20to%20issues%20raised.pdf
Issue
Mrs Kelly mentions that Dr Kelly took a telephone call shortly before leaving. She assumed it was the MOD. This was not investigated.
Response
The matter was investigated. Dr Kelly took a call from the MOD at 14.52.
When Wing Commander John Clark made his first visit to the Inquiry on 27 August there was this exchange with Mr Knox:
Q. At what time did you attempt to ring Dr Kelly?
A. It was -- I have since been told by the police -- I thought it was close to 3 o'clock but it was about 3.20, and I was told by his wife who answered the telephone that Dr Kelly had gone for a walk at 3 o'clock.
Q. Can you recall what the last telephone conversation you actually had with Dr Kelly was before that attempt to get hold of him?
A. Yes, I had a call with him which was just before 3 o'clock. Again I thought it was earlier but we have been able to track that down from investigating my log of e-mails and the telephone log that the police were able to provide. So about 6 or 7 minutes before 3 o'clock was the last conversation. That was the one where we discussed Susan Watts and the business cards.
Q. When you say Susan Watts, i.e. appearing in the body of the text?
A. Absolutely right. So that had been agreed.
The timing of this phone call creates a problem with Ms Absalom's evidence ... at least with the timings here:
Q. On 17th July, what time did you walk your dog?
A. Well, I usually go about 3 but I went earlier that day, I suppose about quarter past 2.
Q. Quarter past 2?
A. Yes.
Q. Did you see anyone while you were walking the dog?
A. Not until I met Dr Kelly.
Q. And when did you meet Dr Kelly? What time was that?
A. Round about 3 o'clock. I could not tell you for sure, I did not bother to look at my watch but I was taking the dog for a walk and --
Q. Where did you meet him?
A. The top of Harris's Lane, which is in Longworth, the next village. It is about -- roughly about a mile from
my home.
Q. How far from his home is that?
A. Well, he is only a matter of yards across the road from me.
Q. So about just under a mile from his home; is that right?
A. Yes.
If Ms Absalom habitually took her dog for a walk at 3 o'clock then the fact that on one day she left about 45 minutes early would perhaps be something that stuck in her mind. My best guess is that she did go at about 2.15 one day, but not on the 17th. Her two page witness statement (date not revealed) might give different timings. I don't think that Hutton would be concerned if that was the case, from his perspective I imagine his primary concern was validation of the fact that Dr Kelly was seen at a point between his home and Harrowdown Hill during that afternoon.
In reviewing the times given by Ms Absalom I would suggest that Dr Kelly was 15 - 20 minutes from his home by the shortest route when he met her at the top of Harris's Lane.
Showing posts with label John Clark. Show all posts
Showing posts with label John Clark. Show all posts
Tuesday, 31 July 2012
Saturday, 30 June 2012
The mobile phone was switched off
ACC Page is asked at the Inquiry about whether the mobile phone was switched on or off when it was discovered in the pocket of the Barbour jacket. His reply:
My recollection is that when found it was off.
The first of the five people who tried to ring Dr Kelly was John Clark. He is clear that he had an electronic response that was proof of the phone being turned off. Similarly the last of the five, Olivia Bosch also got an electronic response but the detail is hazy as to the nature of this message. James Harrison and Bryan Wells it seems each rang with no response as if perhaps the phone was on but not being answered; their attempts to call Dr Kelly were only ten minutes apart. Rachel Kelly simply says 'I could not reach him on his mobile phone'
Are these variations in response indicative of some quirk with mobile phones ... that sometimes the electronic response cuts in quickly and on other occasions you have to wait for a considerable number of rings. In the latter circumstance the caller might ring off too early. I don't know enough about this subject to know whether this can happen but otherwise it appears possible that the phone was turned off, then turned on by Dr Kelly (or a third party) but with incoming calls ignored and finally turned off.
Paragraphs 2, 3 and 4 from Annex TVP-5 supply a little more illumination: http://www.attorneygeneral.gov.uk/Publications/Documents/Annex%20TVP%205.pdf
2. At a meeting held at 5.00am on Thursday 17th July 2003 cell site data was ordered on the mobile telephone of Dr Kelly in an attempt to pin point its location. Unfortunately the phone was switched off so cell site data could not be retrieved. Following the discovery of Dr Kelly's body his mobile phone was found, turned off, in his coat pocket.
3. At that time cell site techniques were not as advanced as they are now and technicians were unable to trace when the mobile last accessed the network (or where) as there had not been live cell site tracing on the phone at the time.
4. Technicians were able to say that mobile communications were operating correctly in the Longworth area on the 17th and 18th July although one sector was showing slight congestion on the afternoon of the 18th.
The date quoted in paragraph 2 is meant to be "Friday 18th July" I imagine. Perhaps the "congestion" mentioned in paragraph 4 resulted from intense media use of the airwaves that afternoon.
Normally Dr Kelly was well known as a person always contactable because he kept his mobile phone on. Therefore goes one argument he set off to commit suicide by keeping his phone off so that he couldn't be contacted or his location known. My counter argument to this is why take his phone at all. We know that the phone wouldn't have already been in the jacket because the last outgoing call was at 12.58 that day, a time according to Mrs Kelly's testimony when he was at their home.
Perhaps Dr Kelly took his phone as he normally would on his walks but decided to leave it turned off. From his perspective he might have thought that his last conversation with John Clark shortly before 3 o'clock had finally wrapped up all the points he had had to deal with and that he needed a walk uninterrupted by telephone calls to try and wind down from what had been a tumultuous and stressful week. Speculation on my part? Certainly. I don't think it's possible to come to any definitive explanation as to why, unusually, the mobile phone was switched off.
My recollection is that when found it was off.
The first of the five people who tried to ring Dr Kelly was John Clark. He is clear that he had an electronic response that was proof of the phone being turned off. Similarly the last of the five, Olivia Bosch also got an electronic response but the detail is hazy as to the nature of this message. James Harrison and Bryan Wells it seems each rang with no response as if perhaps the phone was on but not being answered; their attempts to call Dr Kelly were only ten minutes apart. Rachel Kelly simply says 'I could not reach him on his mobile phone'
Are these variations in response indicative of some quirk with mobile phones ... that sometimes the electronic response cuts in quickly and on other occasions you have to wait for a considerable number of rings. In the latter circumstance the caller might ring off too early. I don't know enough about this subject to know whether this can happen but otherwise it appears possible that the phone was turned off, then turned on by Dr Kelly (or a third party) but with incoming calls ignored and finally turned off.
Paragraphs 2, 3 and 4 from Annex TVP-5 supply a little more illumination: http://www.attorneygeneral.gov.uk/Publications/Documents/Annex%20TVP%205.pdf
2. At a meeting held at 5.00am on Thursday 17th July 2003 cell site data was ordered on the mobile telephone of Dr Kelly in an attempt to pin point its location. Unfortunately the phone was switched off so cell site data could not be retrieved. Following the discovery of Dr Kelly's body his mobile phone was found, turned off, in his coat pocket.
3. At that time cell site techniques were not as advanced as they are now and technicians were unable to trace when the mobile last accessed the network (or where) as there had not been live cell site tracing on the phone at the time.
4. Technicians were able to say that mobile communications were operating correctly in the Longworth area on the 17th and 18th July although one sector was showing slight congestion on the afternoon of the 18th.
The date quoted in paragraph 2 is meant to be "Friday 18th July" I imagine. Perhaps the "congestion" mentioned in paragraph 4 resulted from intense media use of the airwaves that afternoon.
Normally Dr Kelly was well known as a person always contactable because he kept his mobile phone on. Therefore goes one argument he set off to commit suicide by keeping his phone off so that he couldn't be contacted or his location known. My counter argument to this is why take his phone at all. We know that the phone wouldn't have already been in the jacket because the last outgoing call was at 12.58 that day, a time according to Mrs Kelly's testimony when he was at their home.
Perhaps Dr Kelly took his phone as he normally would on his walks but decided to leave it turned off. From his perspective he might have thought that his last conversation with John Clark shortly before 3 o'clock had finally wrapped up all the points he had had to deal with and that he needed a walk uninterrupted by telephone calls to try and wind down from what had been a tumultuous and stressful week. Speculation on my part? Certainly. I don't think it's possible to come to any definitive explanation as to why, unusually, the mobile phone was switched off.
Friday, 29 June 2012
The mobile phone and James Harrison
At this point I need to make a correction, thinking that I had mentioned all those known to have rung the mobile. In the late afternoon of 17 July John Clark had to go to an appointment with the optician. A colleague, James Harrison, made one further attempt to ring Dr Kelly's mobile and this is Mr Harrison answering Mr Knox's questions on 27 August:
Q. Did you try to call Dr Kelly on his mobile?
A. Yes. John had left at, as I say, around 5 o'clock and he had tried to ring -- he had spoken to Mrs Kelly shortly before that. I was very conscious of the need to get the balance right. On the one hand, we had to try to answer these questions and the letter fully and accurately on that day if we could. At the same time, I did not want to be bothering Mrs Kelly on the phone or David indeed unnecessarily soon, when there were already messages for David to ring back.
Q. When you rang Dr Kelly's mobile phone --
A. Yes.
Q. -- what was the response? Was it dead, completely dead or was there any electronic voicemail?
A. My recollection is it rang and was not answered and I rang at about 10 to 6 or thereabouts.
Q. I think we heard from Wing Commander Clark that when he tried calling there was an automated response.
A. Yes.
Q. You say when you tried it was simply ringing and there was no automated response?
A. Yes. We discussed this issue the following day, the Friday. Bryan Wells was in the office and that was after it had been announced by the police that David Kelly was missing. We compared noting on our telephone conversations. I think Bryan Wells had tried shortly after I had and at that time on the Friday morning my clear recollection was that I had rung his
mobile number and that the phone had rung but not been answered.
Q. And you may already have said, what was the precise time as far as you can tell that you first tried to get hold of the mobile?
A. At around 10 to 6. That was the only time.
From the above it seems as if Bryan Wells had also tried to contact Dr Kelly but to no avail.
The "questions" referred to in the testimony will be the subject of a later post.
The mobile phone - John Clark evidence
After Dr Kelly left his home on the afternoon of 17 July his colleague Wing Commander John Clark repeatedly tried to contact him on his mobile phone:
Q. At what time did you attempt to ring Dr Kelly?
A. It was -- I have since been told by the police -- I thought it was close to 3 o'clock but it was about 3.20, and I was told by his wife who answered the telephone that Dr Kelly had gone for a walk at 3 o'clock.
Q. Can you recall what the last telephone conversation you actually had with Dr Kelly was before that attempt to get hold of him?
A. Yes, I had a call with him which was just before 3 o'clock. Again I thought it was earlier but we have been able to track that down from investigating my log of e-mails and the telephone log that the police were able to provide. So about 6 or 7 minutes before 3 o'clock was the last conversation. That was the one where we discussed Susan Watts and the business cards.
Q. When you say Susan Watts, i.e. appearing in the body of the text?
A. Absolutely right. So that had been agreed.
Q. And after you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly, what did you do?
A. I was surprised that I could not get two-way with him because he was always very proud of his ability to be contacted. He took his mobile phone everywhere. I do not mean to be light-hearted but an example of that was that one day I rang him up and I could hardly hear what he was saying because he was on his lawnmower cutting his grass. But that is the sort of man he was; he was always contactable. So on this occasion when I rang him I asked his wife in the first instance when she said he went for a walk, did he have his mobile, and she did not know. I rang and it was switched off and I was very surprised that it had been switched off.
Q. When you say it was switched off, did you get any message?
A. Yes, I got an electronic voice saying: the number you have rung is not reacting. Which is the normal one that one would associate if the telephone itself had been switched off.
Q. After you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly on the mobile then, did you try again?
A. I rang his wife because clearly I needed to get the staff work taken forward and I needed to speak to Dr Kelly. I spoke to her and said I had not been able to contact Dr Kelly on his mobile and I thought she might say something but she was quite matter of fact and said, you know -- did not really record the fact. I then said: could you ask Dr Kelly when he returns, could he give me a ring. That is how the message was left with his wife.
Q. Did you try to get hold of Dr Kelly again?
A. Yes, I did. I hoped that he would perhaps switch on his mobile so I probably tried about every 15 minutes for the remainder of the time. I left the Ministry of Defence at about 10 to 5 because I had an optician's appointment and then handed over responsibility to my colleague, James Harrison.
Q. Did you get the same message every time you rang the mobile?
Q. At what time did you attempt to ring Dr Kelly?
A. It was -- I have since been told by the police -- I thought it was close to 3 o'clock but it was about 3.20, and I was told by his wife who answered the telephone that Dr Kelly had gone for a walk at 3 o'clock.
Q. Can you recall what the last telephone conversation you actually had with Dr Kelly was before that attempt to get hold of him?
A. Yes, I had a call with him which was just before 3 o'clock. Again I thought it was earlier but we have been able to track that down from investigating my log of e-mails and the telephone log that the police were able to provide. So about 6 or 7 minutes before 3 o'clock was the last conversation. That was the one where we discussed Susan Watts and the business cards.
Q. When you say Susan Watts, i.e. appearing in the body of the text?
A. Absolutely right. So that had been agreed.
Q. And after you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly, what did you do?
A. I was surprised that I could not get two-way with him because he was always very proud of his ability to be contacted. He took his mobile phone everywhere. I do not mean to be light-hearted but an example of that was that one day I rang him up and I could hardly hear what he was saying because he was on his lawnmower cutting his grass. But that is the sort of man he was; he was always contactable. So on this occasion when I rang him I asked his wife in the first instance when she said he went for a walk, did he have his mobile, and she did not know. I rang and it was switched off and I was very surprised that it had been switched off.
Q. When you say it was switched off, did you get any message?
A. Yes, I got an electronic voice saying: the number you have rung is not reacting. Which is the normal one that one would associate if the telephone itself had been switched off.
Q. After you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly on the mobile then, did you try again?
A. I rang his wife because clearly I needed to get the staff work taken forward and I needed to speak to Dr Kelly. I spoke to her and said I had not been able to contact Dr Kelly on his mobile and I thought she might say something but she was quite matter of fact and said, you know -- did not really record the fact. I then said: could you ask Dr Kelly when he returns, could he give me a ring. That is how the message was left with his wife.
Q. Did you try to get hold of Dr Kelly again?
A. Yes, I did. I hoped that he would perhaps switch on his mobile so I probably tried about every 15 minutes for the remainder of the time. I left the Ministry of Defence at about 10 to 5 because I had an optician's appointment and then handed over responsibility to my colleague, James Harrison.
Q. Did you get the same message every time you rang the mobile?
A. Yes. It was never switched on.
Journalist Tom Mangold argues that the repeated attempts by John Clark to contact Dr Kelly is evidence of Kelly's intention to commit suicide. Discussion of this will have to wait though.
Friday, 11 May 2012
Mrs Kelly failed to mention these phone calls
Dr Kelly's colleague Wing Commander John Clark spoke to him shortly before 3 pm on 17th July. This call was evidently to Dr Kelly's home telephone and was to be the last time that John Clark made contact with him.
In his examination by Mr Knox on 27 August 2003 John Clark mentions two further phone calls that he made ... calls answered by Mrs Kelly:
In his examination by Mr Knox on 27 August 2003 John Clark mentions two further phone calls that he made ... calls answered by Mrs Kelly:
MR KNOX: In the course of these conversations were you told by anyone that any further contacts with journalists had to be checked with Dr Kelly?
A. Yes, I was contacted by the Secretary of State's office and he brought up the subject of the article that had been published on 13th July, written by Nick Rufford. Now, Dr Kelly had made no reference to that meeting in his one-to-one meetings, and I was asked to check with Dr Kelly if that meeting had taken place and, if it had, then really it ought to be included in the response.
Q. Before we go on for a moment, when you say the Secretary of State's office contacted you, who was the individual you spoke to?
A. It was his PS -- can I check my notes?
Q. Before we go on for a moment, when you say the Secretary of State's office contacted you, who was the individual you spoke to?
A. It was his PS -- can I check my notes?
Q. Was it a Mr Wilson?
A. No, it was Peter.
Q. Peter Watkins?
A. Peter Watkins.
A. Peter Watkins.
Q. What did you do?
A. Again I discussed it with James Harrison with Bryan Wells and attempted to ring Dr Kelly.
Q. At what time did you attempt to ring Dr Kelly?
A. It was -- I have since been told by the police -- I thought it was close to 3 o'clock but it was about 3.20, and I was told by his wife who answered the telephone that Dr Kelly had gone for a walk at 3 o'clock.
Q. Can you recall what the last telephone conversation you actually had with Dr Kelly was before that attempt to get hold of him?
A. Yes, I had a call with him which was just before 3 o'clock. Again I thought it was earlier but we have been able to track that down from investigating my log of e-mails and the telephone log that the police were able to provide. So about 6 or 7 minutes before 3 o'clock was the last conversation. That was the one where we discussed Susan Watts and the business cards.
Q. When you say Susan Watts, i.e. appearing in the body of the text?
A. Absolutely right. So that had been agreed.
Q. And after you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly, what did you do?
A. I was surprised that I could not get two-way with him because he was always very proud of his ability to be contacted. He took his mobile phone everywhere. I do not mean to be light-hearted but an example of that was that one day I rang him up and I could hardly hear what
he was saying because he was on his lawnmower cutting his grass. But that is the sort of man he was; he was always contactable. So on this occasion when I rang him I asked his wife in the first instance when she said he went for a walk, did he have his mobile, and she did not
know. I rang and it was switched off and I was very surprised that it had been switched off.
Q. When you say it was switched off, did you get any message?
A. Yes, I got an electronic voice saying: the number you have rung is not reacting. Which is the normal one that one would associate if the telephone itself had been switched off.
Q. After you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly on the mobile then, did you try again?
A. I rang his wife because clearly I needed to get the staff work taken forward and I needed to speak to Dr Kelly. I spoke to her and said I had not been able to contact Dr Kelly on his mobile and I thought she might say something but she was quite matter of fact and
said, you know -- did not really record the fact. I then said: could you ask Dr Kelly when he returns, could he give me a ring. That is how the message was left with his wife.
A. Again I discussed it with James Harrison with Bryan Wells and attempted to ring Dr Kelly.
Q. At what time did you attempt to ring Dr Kelly?
A. It was -- I have since been told by the police -- I thought it was close to 3 o'clock but it was about 3.20, and I was told by his wife who answered the telephone that Dr Kelly had gone for a walk at 3 o'clock.
Q. Can you recall what the last telephone conversation you actually had with Dr Kelly was before that attempt to get hold of him?
A. Yes, I had a call with him which was just before 3 o'clock. Again I thought it was earlier but we have been able to track that down from investigating my log of e-mails and the telephone log that the police were able to provide. So about 6 or 7 minutes before 3 o'clock was the last conversation. That was the one where we discussed Susan Watts and the business cards.
Q. When you say Susan Watts, i.e. appearing in the body of the text?
A. Absolutely right. So that had been agreed.
Q. And after you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly, what did you do?
A. I was surprised that I could not get two-way with him because he was always very proud of his ability to be contacted. He took his mobile phone everywhere. I do not mean to be light-hearted but an example of that was that one day I rang him up and I could hardly hear what
he was saying because he was on his lawnmower cutting his grass. But that is the sort of man he was; he was always contactable. So on this occasion when I rang him I asked his wife in the first instance when she said he went for a walk, did he have his mobile, and she did not
know. I rang and it was switched off and I was very surprised that it had been switched off.
Q. When you say it was switched off, did you get any message?
A. Yes, I got an electronic voice saying: the number you have rung is not reacting. Which is the normal one that one would associate if the telephone itself had been switched off.
Q. After you had not been able to get hold of Dr Kelly on the mobile then, did you try again?
A. I rang his wife because clearly I needed to get the staff work taken forward and I needed to speak to Dr Kelly. I spoke to her and said I had not been able to contact Dr Kelly on his mobile and I thought she might say something but she was quite matter of fact and
said, you know -- did not really record the fact. I then said: could you ask Dr Kelly when he returns, could he give me a ring. That is how the message was left with his wife.
According to John Clark then he had spoken to Mrs Kelly twice after Dr Kelly had apparently left for his walk. Mrs Kelly fails to mention these later phone calls from Clark and Hutton also doesn't raise the subject during Mrs Kelly's examination. This is Mrs Kelly responding to Mr Dingemans:
Q. And did he, in fact, go straight off for his walk?
A. Well, the phone rang a little bit later on and I assumed he had left so I suddenly realised I had not got a cordless phone and I thought it might be an important call for him, perhaps from the MoD. So I went downstairs to find the telephone in the dining room. By this time the ringing had stopped and I was aware of David talking quietly on a phone. I said something
like: I thought you had gone out for a walk. He did not respond of course because he was talking on the phone.
Q. Where was he at this time?
A. In his study.
Q. Do you know what time this was?
A. Not exactly, no. Getting on for 3, I would think.
Q. Do you know who the caller was?
A. I assumed it was the MoD, I am not sure.
Q. And did Dr Kelly go out for his walk?
A. Well, the phone rang again at about 3.20, after which -- it was a call for me -- a return call for me, and I could not settle in bed so I got up at that stage and I was aware that definitely David had left by this time.
A. Well, the phone rang a little bit later on and I assumed he had left so I suddenly realised I had not got a cordless phone and I thought it might be an important call for him, perhaps from the MoD. So I went downstairs to find the telephone in the dining room. By this time the ringing had stopped and I was aware of David talking quietly on a phone. I said something
like: I thought you had gone out for a walk. He did not respond of course because he was talking on the phone.
Q. Where was he at this time?
A. In his study.
Q. Do you know what time this was?
A. Not exactly, no. Getting on for 3, I would think.
Q. Do you know who the caller was?
A. I assumed it was the MoD, I am not sure.
Q. And did Dr Kelly go out for his walk?
A. Well, the phone rang again at about 3.20, after which -- it was a call for me -- a return call for me, and I could not settle in bed so I got up at that stage and I was aware that definitely David had left by this time.
Why did she fail to mention John Clarks calls and why did Hutton ignore this omission?
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